Tenant's Aggreements - what happens if one is not provided.

[blackkitty2]

Hi there everyone.

I know this is the time to be merry but I have a question about Tenant's Agreements on allotments. What recourse does a plot holder have if they receive a letter stating that they are in breach of one of the rules of their TA, but the TA they have does not refer at all to the thing that they have supposed to have done in any capacity. I mean why state you have breached a rule and send the letter when it does not actually exist in the TA you may have.

Don't read into this ha, ha as it is just a minor thing that has been bugging me for a while.

Ho, ho, ho and all of that!
 

[blackkitty2]

[tim41]

Sorry that you have a problem. But when you know the answer would you please let me know. I am not being funny as i have a smiler problem and we have not even seen are agreement and the council will not let us see it. Sorry a bout the spelling. But good luck.

[Robert_Brenchley]

surely it can't be a valid 'agreement' if you haven't even seen it?

[davyw1]

It is not a vallid agreement till you have signed it and received a copy for ones self.
You sign the agreement to say that you will abide with what has be written on it, anything other than what is not on that agreement is not enforceable.
It may be written in your allotment rules that the committee can amend any rules as they see fit but but you must be informed of this and they are not enforceable till passed by the members at an AGM

[Unwashed]

It may be written in your allotment rules that the committee can amend any rules as they see fit but but you must be informed of this and they are not enforceable till passed by the members at an AGM

That's very common, but I don't believe it's enforceable because of the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999.  A clause that says "the committee can change these rules" or something to that effect purports to allow the committee to make unlimited arbitrary changes to the rules and to my mind the regulations make that kind of latitude unfair.

An agreement is just that, it binds both sides, the landlord can't just add arbitrary stuff without your further agreement.

However, a vindictive committee or council can always try and evict you for breaking a non-existent or unenforceable rule, and if you're on your own basically you don't have a chance.

My Town Council told me to take my English flag and chimbly pot down from my shed because a neighbour had complained that it was an "eye sore".  It wasn't breaking any rule, but the council weren't bothered by details like that.

[marcitos]

In trying to evict wouldn't the Committee/Council have to get a court order, stating the reason? Wouldn't the plotholder then be able to challenge the order as the eviction is not legitimate?

[Unwashed]

In trying to evict wouldn't the Committee/Council have to get a court order, stating the reason? Wouldn't the plotholder then be able to challenge the order as the eviction is not legitimate?

Not necessarily.

If there's a power of re-entry in the tenancy agreement then the committee can just walk onto the plot and you're evicted, and then your only option is to apply yourself to the court for relief from eviction, and even if there isn't a power of re-entry if the committee just kick you off going to court is still your only option.  If you win your case it'll likey still have cost you £200 and a whole bunch of time and stress, and if you lose your case it could cost you £5k if the landlord was represented by a barister - and don't assume that you'll win just because you believe you're right, it's not always that simple.  Likelise if the landlord applies to the court for a possession order, the costs will be the same.

The allotment tenant is uniquely exposed to tyrany because a minority of allotments are run by particularly tyranical and vindictive committees and councils, and the cost of defending your tenancy is out of all proportion to the financial cost of the tenancy itself.

[marcitos]

Unwashed

Just a couple of points to ask you
a) I suppose it would be costly to refer to the Human Rights Act re property rights.

However, is it correct that anyone can write to the Human Rights Commission (Court??|).  When you get e.g. prisoners trying to complain their rights have been breached they don't have pots of money????

b) Wouldn't an unincorporated site have to go & ask it's members whether it can spend the site's funds to hire a solicitor if it did go to court?

[Unwashed]

a) I suppose it would be costly to refer to the Human Rights Act re property rights.

However, is it correct that anyone can write to the Human Rights Commission (Court??|).  When you get e.g. prisoners trying to complain their rights have been breached they don't have pots of money????

There is a decent argument to be made that a parish council unlawfully depriving you of your allotment because you don't have the resources to defend their action in court is a breach of Article 1 of the First Protocol, but the HRC won't take on your case, you would need to find a wealthy interest group like the NSALG, but if you're in the NSALG then the hope would be that they would actually have defended your rights already.

b) Wouldn't an unincorporated site have to go & ask it's members whether it can spend the site's funds to hire a solicitor if it did go to court?

It would depend what the constitution said, but almost certainly not.  The constitution is very likely to say that the management of the site is in the hands of the committee, in which case the committee can legitimately decide what course of action to take.

[blackkitty2]

Thanks for the help everyone! I will try and absorb all your information and try to have a merry Christmas although our sprouts are lathered in white fly and only fit for the chickens.

I am at the point where I have come to the conclusion that the 'overseers' of our allotments are just a couple of old geezers who just come in their 4x4, see whatever infringement they can think of, scuttle off home to whatever rock they crawled out from under and cause some poor beggar mental grief. I am sure it's not just us they hassle, they just do it because they can.

I have thought about contacting the local council about the fact that these geezers are making stuff up as they go along and trying to enforce regulations that don't exist but I have a life. I bet the council can't wait to be rid of them either. The daft buggers even let someone fit their own trough and dig up all the pipes. The coucil guys eyes bulged like cartoon characters when they heard what was going on.

On the plus side we have youth on our side and judging by their ages one of two things will happen - death or disease har, har. I can hardly wait although being of a fluffy charitable nature I would not wish them harm. Maybe I could feed them to my carnivorous plants although they might poison them with their bitter blood.


Enough said ha, ha.